[Boondock]

East Asia allies doubt U.S. could win war with China

Chinese troops lined up for a review by President Bush and China's President Hu Jintao on Nov. 20 in Beijing (Pablo Martinez Monsivais/AP)

The overwhelming assessment by Asian officials, diplomats and analysts is that the U.S. military simply cannot defeat China. It has been an assessment relayed to U.S. government officials over the past few months by countries such as Australia, Japan and South Korea. This comes as President Bush wraps up a visit to Asia, in which he sought to strengthen U.S. ties with key allies in the region.

Most Asian officials have expressed their views privately. Tokyo Governor Shintaro Ishihara has gone public, warning that the United States would lose any war with China.

"In any case, if tension between the United States and China heightens, if each side pulls the trigger, though it may not be stretched to nuclear weapons, and the wider hostilities expand, I believe America cannot win as it has a civic society that must adhere to the value of respecting lives," Mr. Ishihara said in an address to the Washington-based Center for Strategic and International Studies.

Mr. Ishihara said U.S. ground forces, with the exception of the Marines, are "extremely incompetent" and would be unable to stem a Chinese conventional attack. Indeed, he asserted that China would not hesitate to use nuclear weapons against Asian and American cities—even at the risk of a massive U.S. retaliation.

The governor said the U.S. military could not counter a wave of millions of Chinese soldiers prepared to die in any onslaught against U.S. forces. After 2,000 casualties, he said, the U.S. military would be forced to withdraw.

"Therefore, we need to consider other means to counter China," he said. "The step we should be taking against China, I believe, is economic containment."

Officials acknowledge that Mr. Ishihara's views reflect the widespread skepticism of U.S. military capabilities in such countries as Australia, India, Japan, Singapore and South Korea. They said the U.S.-led war in Iraq has pointed to the American weakness in low-tech warfare.

"When we can't even control parts of Anbar, they get the message loud and clear," an official said, referring to the flashpoint province in western Iraq.

As a result, Asian allies of the United States are quietly preparing to bolster their militaries independent of Washington. So far, the Bush administration has been strongly opposed to an indigenous Japanese defense capability, fearing it would lead to the expulsion of the U.S. military presence from that country.

On Nov. 16, Mr. Bush met with Japanese Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi. The two leaders discussed the realignment of the U.S. military presence in Japan and Tokyo's troop deployment in Iraq.

During his visit to Washington in early November, Mr. Ishihara met senior U.S. defense officials. They included talks with U.S. Defense Deputy Undersecretary for Asian and Pacific Affairs Richard Lawless to discuss the realignment of the U.S. military presence in Japan.

For his part, Mr. Ishihara does not see China as evolving into a stable democracy with free elections.

"I believe such predictions are totally wrong," Mr. Ishihara said.







man i hope it never comes to war with china. that would pretty much be the end of civilization as we know it. if we invaded china they would probably poan our asses but if they tried to come this way or do some shit in the air we'd have their yellow asses.

china has been spending money building a solid militry base but the us has been spending billions of dollars annually on advanced weapons and technology that would fuckin destroy them.

here is a nice little fact. the united states spends more on the military/weapons/research and development than the next 32 countries combined

[JamaicanHerb]

nothin i do or say will change it so i'm not gettin myself worked up right this second

[KO]

i know someone that would love this article.


honestly, ive had the same worries, but the comment that US forces are extremely incompitant is offensive

[Boondock]

of course we have to worry about this but honestly the only thing vchina has over the us is it's ability to put soldiers on the field. their entire air force is totally out dated. their tech is behind ours. we are being very passive in iraq right now cause the us is trying to minimize casualties. it would be a whole different scenerio if the gloves come off. we have a totally different kind of monster then. the us could drop munitions on china for months...the scary thought is the use of nukes. i sure wish fermi and oppenheimer wouldn;t have hooked up.

[JamaicanHerb]

i like how the media is comparing stats like its a damn football game about to happen.... ya never know whats gonna happen when it comes down to it...

[Boondock]

[JamaicanHerb]

you dont line up men on each side of a field anymore, u push a button from across the world..... china will just have to see if they made the right decision when they try to start shit

[Ta'veren]

I knew something like this would happen soon. I hope nothin goes down. Maybe if we get someone new in the white house next election things could change a bit.

[JamaicanHerb]

oh jesus where blaming bush for wars he didnt start, and didnt even happen yet...



i love it your all so fuckin stupid u sit there and put all your effort after goin after him and before u know it the republicans will have another one in office.

[Ta'veren]

Imagine if north korea and china became allies, we'd get raped. it'd be a crazy gook invasion

[Ta'veren]

I'm not saying anything about bush starting anything fool. All I'm saying is that maybe someone else could handle the situation better. if it ever occurs.

[JamaicanHerb]

Originally Posted by TheDude

The problem is that our troops are not allowed to fight like they should. If we fought wars like they wars should, we would fuck anybody up. Troops in iraq are getting put in jail for shooting people. Thats not a war. That is bullshit.

iraq is a very touchy subject, but if it came to china alot more people would have to agree and be behind it because they knew it was their lives and their way of life their dealing with, not someone elses way of live in the middle east... i don't think you'd beable to compare that war, to any other war it would be WWIII, but with the technology we have now, it would be insane.. superpowers have friends, and their friends have friends the world is just a giant street gang in a sense if u fuck w/ someones boys their gonna get into it... and the US and China being such superpowers, we both got lots of boys so it wouldn't be fun...

[Ta'veren]

with iraq we don't even really know who the enemies are until they are shooting at us

[TheBagman]

^ or they pull the ripcord to their bomb strapped to their torso...

[Ta'veren]

exactly

[AnnonUSA]

You know for years people said similar things about a war between Russia and the USA.

We obviously would not fare well in a war with China, they are mental and would push the button. The question is will you be living in or near one of the first strike cities if China launched against us? If so will the retaliatory strike make a frikin difference to you?

One lesson that can be learned from the USA / USSR years, is that the hype, chest pounding, and dick wagging is usually a result of the country leaders and not the people. The people of the USSR were happy when the cold war ended.

Anyhow, you guys are correct, a war with China would have to be a real war, no embedded reporters with fuckin cameras, no off limit targets, no worry about collateral damage, just kill kill kill as many of them as possible as quick as possible, cause that is what they would do to us.

The way to win a war with China is to join forces with Russia. A Russian/American vs China War is a likely win.

This post has gotten too long and since this is not likely to happen I'd rather be

[KO]

Originally Posted by AnnonUSA

The question is will you be living in or near one of the first strike cities if China launched against us?

Well we would both be dead, there isnt a questoin of that

[gilligan]

well if we had to fight with tv cameras there and play by the rules we would simply be outmanned. But like you said boon we have the technology we could bomb the fucking shit out of them but in ground hand to hand combat i dont know how we would do simlply because we would be so outnumbered.

[AnnonUSA]

Plus, don't the fucking Chineese birth like a whole new army everyday?